Doesn't this sound familiar?

[Gusei21]

http://karatejutsu.blogspot.com/2008/09 ... kamae.html

or this one where Pat Nakata quotes Otsuka Sensei.

http://karatejutsu.blogspot.com/2008/05 ... ition.html

[oneya]

All familiar stuff indeed Bob but simultaneously we have the concept of karate shiai and kata in many instances (predominantly ?) being judged according to the - now familiar - kamae aspect because the concept of osae isn't that well understood or taught in the western world. For the western sensei it can be a complex issue and often too difficult to grasp because of its perpetually morphing dynamic if the other base duality aspects like omote/ura/ and honne/tatemae haven't been chewed and digested first.

[WadoAJ]

I would say that is how it should be.
Nevertheless, 1st move of pinan shodan right hand we call kamae. I guess it just depends on your interpretation of the word kamae. Of course, the right arm can also be used before, after or at the same time of the left jodan uke. Nothing dead there, hopefully

[kyudo]

Thanks Bob, interesting.
But did you notice this remark by Pat Nakata:
>I was fortunate to have been able to listen to a discussion between Ueshiba Morihei Sensei (founder of Aikido) and Otsuka Hironori Shihan
>(founder of Wado-Ryu Karate) on "real" fighting application.

Didn't we have a discussion sometime, somewhere, wondering if Otsuka ever even met Ueshiba? Nakata might have a few interesting things to say on the subject. Anyone here connected to him?

[Gusei21]

Didn't we have a discussion sometime, somewhere, wondering if Otsuka ever even met Ueshiba? Nakata might have a few interesting things to say on the subject. Anyone here connected to him?

Not with me Igor. I know Uyeshiba and Otsuka had their encounters. On a separate note Ajari trained at Ueshiba's dojo. Did not last very long but at least he had some mat time with the aikido legend.

On a separate note this is really interesting. Follow these series of videos to their conclusion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx9RMDIq ... re=related

[omote]

Didn't we have a discussion sometime, somewhere, wondering if Otsuka ever even met Ueshiba? Nakata might have a few interesting things to say on the subject. Anyone here connected to him?

Not with me Igor. I know Uyeshiba and Otsuka had their encounters. On a separate note Ajari trained at Ueshiba's dojo. Did not last very long but at least he had some mat time with the aikido legend.

On a separate note this is really interesting. Follow these series of videos to their conclusion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx9RMDIq ... re=related

Very interesting stuff. What a twist to the history we all grew up listening to and reading.

What do you think about Mr. Nakata's interpretation of the opening movements of kata like Naihanshi?

Jay Boatright

[Gusei21]

Very interesting stuff. What a twist to the history we all grew up listening to and reading.

What do you think about Mr. Nakata's interpretation of the opening movements of kata like Naihanshi?

Jay Boatright

Like your moniker says...it is just the omote explanation.
The ura explanation depends on the style I think.
I showed you what I believe to be the Wado ura version....which is all about teaching arm body connection.

[oneya]

Or arm - body - energy - nukeru - connection..?

oneya

[kyudo]

On a separate note this is really interesting. Follow these series of videos to their conclusion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx9RMDIq ... re=related

I intended to watch only one, but wound up watching all the parts in one go. Loved it.
Thanks for posting.

[Gusei21]

Or arm - body - energy - nukeru - connection..?

oneya

And the WIKF let you guys just walk out the door?
I will bet no one in your former group has a clue what you are talking about.....what a waste.
Maybe you can come back as a technical consultant and charge 5 times more.