Changes in kata

[wadoka]

Normally if you have taken part in a thread, then if someone makes a new post in that thread you get an email to say, dear XXX, a new post has been made in thread YYY.

However, I have set this forum so that when someone new makes a post, I have to manually authorise it until they have made a couple of posts and then they are treated normally.

Sometimes it can take a day or two before I spot that I need to approve something. My question was, did you get an email to say the thread has a new post when I approved Philip's post? This is why I made the welcome message as I know that should then send the notification out.

Makes sense? I am just trying to see what I can do to make things move along nicely.

[oneya]

Yep, Thanks G it makes good sense, I didn't get any notice in this case..
oneya

[wadoka]

That is a bit of a pain as sometimes new people may make a new post but by the time I approve it, there could have been a page or two of comments, so it might remain unseen if people dont pick up on it. I might just make mention of it if I feel it might have gone unnoticed.

Back to the chat.

[kyudo]

That is a bit of a pain as sometimes

Be that as it may, I'm glad you choose to monitor new contributors in order to keep things civil around here. I realize this takes a bit of effort on your part and we owe you for it.
Thanks.

[wadoka]

Thank you for saying so.

I try and do my bit and not let this place become a free-for-all spam fest.

[AG1]

I would suggest a serious alternative for the Wado kokusai to consider must be the option to actually rejoin Wadokai. Some dojo have tried that individually - without success yet as it happens - but for the long term benefit of Wado I would see the group rejoining as a positive. How the integration happens is a problem of course...but some problems can be good to have to deal with. If ever there was a time to do it, it is now whilst the few remaining active generation of Otsuka students are still around to teach.

Ben

It is already happening. in Sweden several WIKF dojos have already converted to the Wadokai. The senior blackbelts in those dojos have taken, passed and have been awarded Wadokai dan grades. Some of you recall the tanto video from the WIKF tanto competition that was posted here on our forum. The two who won the event are now Wadokai members. In the past the Wadokai accepted up to WIKF sandans to transfer to the Wadokai without having to retest. Unfortunately at the moment the Wadokai has placed that policy on hold but this has not deterred some of the WIKF members with senior dan grades to restart from shodan in the Wadokai which has impressed some of the senior Wadokai leadership.

The last person who managed to get a Wadokai transfer was a former WIKF person from the Dominican Republic last year. He converted his organization to the Wadokai. This trend will continue to increase.

Ben: You may save your advice about what WIKF should or should not do for yourself. We know what our mission is and where we are headed, and that is good enough for us. Having trained under Suzuki Sensei and followed his way for decades, we don't see the need to join Wadokai or any other Wado group for that matter. There is a deep talent pool and knowledge within our ranks (not to mention a well-known cadre of some of the best fighters of their times). We don't expect or care for non-Suzuki disciples to appreciate that.

Gusei21: "This trend will continue to increase" - Wishful thinking. The driver for the defections in Sweden and Dominican Republic (and I've known Frank Abreu much longer than you) was political (in most cases, differences with local leadership/organizations;they wanted to either have a parallel WIKF structure or to take over leadership in their respective countries) and nothing to do with the WIKF new leadership. In fact, many of the people in the US who left the WIKF (at that time, a much higher percentage of WIKF membership than the recent Swedish defections) under false pretences later tried to rejoin WIKF, only to be refused by Suzuki Sensei. He always put quality ahead of quantity, so losing a few members does not rattle WIKF. The core of WIKF, including the Executive and Technical committees remain intact and fully committed to the WIKF and its values.

Respectfully,

AG1

PS For a suppossedly apolitical Wado forum, I find the various references and opinions regarding WIKF from people who are clueless about the organization or its people disconcerting.

[Gusei21]

Gusei21: "This trend will continue to increase" - Wishful thinking. The driver for the defections in Sweden and Dominican Republic (and I've known Frank Abreu much longer than you) was political (in most cases, differences with local leadership/organizations;they wanted to either have a parallel WIKF structure or to take over leadership in their respective countries) and nothing to do with the WIKF new leadership. In fact, many of the people in the US who left the WIKF (at that time, a much higher percentage of WIKF membership than the recent Swedish defections) under false pretences later tried to rejoin WIKF, only to be refused by Suzuki Sensei. He always put quality ahead of quantity, so losing a few members does not rattle WIKF. The core of WIKF, including the Executive and Technical committees remain intact and fully committed to the WIKF and its values.

Respectfully,

AG1

PS For a suppossedly apolitical Wado forum, I find the various references and opinions regarding WIKF from people who are clueless about the organization or its people disconcerting.

Dear AG1,
The reason for me saying that the trend will continue to increase - is because I keep getting emails from WIKF people from various countries asking what it will take to convert to the Wadokai. The recent policy of the Wadokai stating that WIKF blackbelts have to restart from shodan might be a game changer for some but I guess it depends on what it important to them. I personally don't care whether people come over or not and I have never advertised or suggested to anyone that they join the Wadokai. I have only helped people after they initiated the action on their own.
As for Frank Abreu, there is no doubt you have known him longer and you probably know him better than I do. To this day I don't really understand why his group left the WIKF. I guess there are reasons and then there are reasons. I have no clue. The only thing I cared about was that he fully resigned from the WIKF before I would talk to him about tranferring over to the Wadokai. And I don't really care if the Swedish people left because they were disgruntled with their local leadership or the central leadership. All I know is that some leadership screwed that one up big time but ultimately the responsibility should lay with the top leadership so if the new leadership does not want to be accountable for this then .... oh well. Again, not my problem.
So you are saying that a large percentage of the US WIKF membership left under false pretenses? That is news to me. What false pretenses? And this said group wanted to rejoin the WIKF but were denied reentry? Really? If you say so. I was not involved in any of that and only met those folks after they had left so I will defer to you.
For the record (again) I don't really care if people join the Wadokai. The only reason I am a member is because my teacher is a member so I make the most of it. If my teacher quit tomorrow then I would follow him.
I don't think this forum has to be apolitical. Nothing wrong with being political. Some of us still make fun of the Shintani group. But that is not really politcal. Not sure what political means at the moment. All i know is that I have friends in all kinds of Wado groups and the cool part is that my friends and I speak the same technical language. And i think that is why people come to this forum. Many of us share the same technical language and that is what makes this place fun.

[blackcat]

I would suggest a serious alternative for the Wado kokusai to consider must be the option to actually rejoin Wadokai. Some dojo have tried that individually - without success yet as it happens - but for the long term benefit of Wado I would see the group rejoining as a positive. How the integration happens is a problem of course...but some problems can be good to have to deal with. If ever there was a time to do it, it is now whilst the few remaining active generation of Otsuka students are still around to teach.

Ben

Ben: You may save your advice about what WIKF should or should not do for yourself. We know what our mission is and where we are headed, and that is good enough for us. Having trained under Suzuki Sensei and followed his way for decades, we don't see the need to join Wadokai or any other Wado group for that matter. There is a deep talent pool and knowledge within our ranks (not to mention a well-known cadre of some of the best fighters of their times). We don't expect or care for non-Suzuki disciples to appreciate that.

Respectfully,

AG1

PS For a suppossedly apolitical Wado forum, I find the various references and opinions regarding WIKF from people who are clueless about the organization or its people disconcerting.

Arturo

For what it's worth, I don't particularly care what the WIKF decides to do, but the UK is a free country and if I want to offer an opinion - political or otherwise - I will do so.

For me, you can have as many ex tournament players as you want in a group, it makes no odds whatsover to the quality of Wadoryu taught. Train in a dojo with someone who has trained regularly with the founder of Wadoryu...now that provides a real opportunity to make progress. Those opportunities are still there. I would question the motives of any teacher who discourages their students from doing so.

Enjoy your training,

Ben

[AG1]

Ben: of course you are entitled to express your opinion, but offering advice to WIKF ("I would suggest a serious alternative for the Wado kokusai to consider...") is presumptuous on your part, wouldn't you think?

Bob: I'm here to talk Wado and not to embarass anyone (except perhaps for the Shintani group), but I lived through the entire episode when Butch & Co split and will be happy to share with you details and even documents offline if you ever feel the curiosity to know what really went on. I should add that this is all water under the bridge now so I personally don't have any particular interest to elaborate on the subject.

Best,

[blackcat]

Ben: of course you are entitled to express your opinion, but offering advice to WIKF ("I would suggest a serious alternative for the Wado kokusai to consider...") is presumptuous on your part, wouldn't you think?


Best,

Hi Arturo

I don't see it as presumptious. This board is intended as a forum for discussion of 'Wadoryu' matters and WIKF is regarded as one of the three main groups. WIKF came out of Wadoryu Renmei which in turn came out of JKF Wadokai. They are all linked. The majority of members of each group are where they are because of who they trained with at the time of the various reorganisations. I would guess perhaps 90% of us fall into that category and the remainder have probably moved to where they are through disaffection with their particular situation since.

All I offered was an idea, if it had not already been discounted. I think I also added that I didn't expect it would be decided off the back of a forum discussion.

Anyway, WIKF members are welcome to join any seminars we host with visiting instructors and may rest assured they will not be coerced into joining Wadokai if they do!

Ben